SwoopCombat
Creator: mcSWOOPYsf || First Published: 12/01/2014 || Players: 2 || Size: 30x20
Categories: C-Rank, Standard
Rating: 5.00 in 3 ratings
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Comments:
KrittyKat (12/01/2014 04:20pm):
Ok. A half decent map. You can improve, the first thing you want is ABSOLUTE symmetry. Another thing the shoal
in front of both ports block every ship except lander, so removing is kinda recommended. (Unless you want only
landers) Next is the base and airport in the middle. Not recommended as that creates a rush for both players to
nab it and usually decides a winner. You can keep the cities.
mcSWOOPYsf (12/01/2014 05:51pm | Edited: 12/04/2014 12:15pm):
**UPDATED**

Added com towers to center island. Added a few more bases and cities near the shore line. Added airport near
both teams starting areas so that air units can help.
----
Removed airport and base from center island. Added shoal to majority of coast line. Added a few more bases
in hopes to serve as potential points of invasion. Cities added in various places and to center island.

***

I didn't realize the error with the shoal but could be a benefit. Noted about the center point. Thank you for the
constructive criticisms.
Xmo5 (12/01/2014 07:22pm):
KrittyKat, I have to say that I wish more people did what you did. IIRC you mentioned on one of your
maps/comments that you lurked for a while before partaking in the action and you've totally hit the
ground running. Honestly, I couldn't care less if every map you ever make sucks (they don't),
because you actually came into this knowing all of the important basics that you usually have to drill
through peoples' heads for months before it starts to catch on.

Somehow I end up volunteering myself for most of the new map maker training (or attempts at it
anyway) so having people like you come in the way you did saves me a lot of effort and it helps
restore a bit of my faith in humanity. Not only that, but you and the-deadly-shadow (one of my former
map "apprentices" if you will) are actually helping to teach the new map makers.

Moral of the story is kudos to you for being the most boss noob ever and thanks to both you and the-
deadly-shadow for trying to help new map makers figure out what most of us eventually learn (or
should anyway).
superspeedy (12/01/2014 07:23pm):
you might want to make bridges between the islands so the bases on either side won't be totally useless in
turn add a little more cities to support an invasion/defence cost
MorganLeah (12/02/2014 03:07pm):
I agree with Xmo5's sentiments. Honestly I need to be giving my advice out more, I've been
slacking lately. So I'll start here!

First, everything KrittyKat said is right on (except for the absolute symmetry; well in
practice that's right, but truthfully it's not required as such, it's just that making
balanced nonsymmetrical maps is insanely complicated compared to symmetrical ones) In
particular the lone airport and base in the middle need to go. Some properties, and if you
wanted, one tower, would be fine for the middle.

You're also going to want more properties than you currently have, unless this is intended
to be a high funds map.

One other major point: Invading the other side's land is almost completely impossible to
pull off successfully. I actually see this a lot with maps that don't have connected
lands. The problem is that it's way too easy for one side to just pile infantry on shoals
and/or indirects near them to crush any and all attempts at invasion. This problem is
compounded by only allowing landers and black boats, as at least battleships can kind of
do something to help gain a foothold. The main point is, if you want to force an invasion
from sea onto enemy territory to win, there has to be so many places to land and gain a
foothold that the defender can't possibly cover them all. That means way more shoals
(landing points) and defensive terrain (forest/cities/mountains/etc) in the vicinity of
these landing points.

My suspicion that the reason this is as common a problem as it is is because on the carts
a number of maps utilize the idea (and of course it has historical merit; D-Day for
example). The thing is, with those maps (I mainly remember a bunch of islandy war room
maps) you're playing against the AI. Here you play people, and they're capable of
exploiting their defenses to foil sea invasions in ways the AI doesn't.

Also, consider giving each side a predeployed lander/black boat, help them jump-start the
invasion because boats are needlessly expensive.

Phoo that ended up way longer than I thought it would haha.
blozzee (12/04/2014 12:30pm):
I think those com towers are too contested though. Also, I would probably add up few roads
in the middle Island if were you.
Xmo5 (12/04/2014 01:52pm):
I pretty much stand by what others have said. I can't emphasize MorganLeah's comment on
symmetry enough because a lot of new map makers don't understand it. Especially for some
of your first maps, perfect symmetry is highly recommended. Once you get a firm grasp on
the concepts of balance and how they play out on a map, feel free to venture into
asymmetric maps, but they are very, very, *very* difficult to balance perfectly so the
solid understanding is key.

blozze brings up good points about the center as well. Two towers is a bit much in the
middle because it makes the value of the center island too great. It's likely that one
player will take the whole island and taking it back will be difficult so 1 tower should
suffice if you do things that way. Also, MorganLeah's comment on landing invasions is spot
on so I recommend one of the following:

1. Add connections as superspeedy suggested so that land units can cross over to enemy
territory.

2. Make it so that BM is much much closer to the bases on OS island and vice versa so that
they can land/invade early on and capture the neutral base(s). Regardless, make it clear
which bases belong to which players so nobody can rush early (in either direction) and
throw off the balance.

Finally, I'd recommend starting with only 3-4k funds each (1 HQ and 2 bases, possibly the
port too). A lot can be done with 6k and it makes it harder to properly balance FTA.

Hope to see more maps in the future! (Remember, practice makes perfect!)
walkerboh01 (02/05/2015 03:49am):
Essaaaaaaaaaaaaaaays. Giving this a 5/10 until improvements suggested above are
implemented.
Xmo5 (07/07/2016 11:49am):
Upon reflection, too close to Swoobat.

http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Swoobat_%28Pok%C3%A9mon%29
Nyvelion (08/01/2016 09:46am):
Wow I was way off, I thought it was one of the Unowns.



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